First of all, see the thread below on TT.

http://www.titantalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=255900&posted=1#post255900

The above thread got out of hand real quick and I'm afraid it may have been my fault. :oops: It just stinks of misinformation to me. Nonetheless, the question for all the tech gurus (that means you JetTech, and others) is:

Will installing even slightly different size rims and tires make VDC not work properly??? Apparently a Nissan VP says "Yes"? What gives? Does this mean our ABS and ABLS are not there for us in full effect, with aftermarket wheels and tires, either since VDC utilizes these features as well???

Hi TH, I read the post over on TT and to be honest I can't see why different sized tires would have any effect on the VDC function. There is one circumstance I can think of that would wreak total havok on the system and that's installing different sizes front and rear. Now that would confuse the heck out of it, but I see no reason it would get confused by different sized (all 4) tires. If you look at the inputs of what VDC is looking at, it could care less if your running 13's or 24's...

Comparisons between rotational speeds of all 4 tires, along with ABLS inputs (slip), yaw sensor, steering wheel angle, and brake assist all play into the overall operation of VDC. I feel that those who turn it off, during their normal commute, are asking for trouble if they get between a rock and a hard place. It's truly a wonderful feature and IMHO, I think it's the best option out there.

The answer is "no, it will not matter" if you change all 4 tires. The answer is "yes, it will matter" if you go different front and rear.

I run shorter tires on the 17" off-road wheels in the rear at the track when dragracing and still have the stock 18" LE wheels and tires up front. If I leave the VDC on, it will activate the 'slip' light at about 20-25mph on the speedo. The VDC thinks the rears are spinning since they are rotating more revolutions than the fronts. This isn't a problem during a run because I turn off the VDC anyway (the traction control will absolutely kill a run if it activates).

The other thing to consider is that right now you can't correct the speedo for different tire sizes. The speedo calibrators you see all over the place will not work on our trucks. There is no "wire" to tap into since it's part of the CAN system.

I agree, it should have no affect on the VDC by changing to different wheels and tires as long as front and rear are the same. I would say that the "VP" just has to say things to cover his a$$ is all. If that were the case than you wouldn't be able to replace the tires when they wear out cuz different makes of tires are all slightly different diameters, for that fact the OEM ties will change diameter as they wear out. :) I call BS.

I thought so! And it was a good point that not all manufacturers tires are the same diameter even though they are the same size! I have seen as much as 1/2 an inch difference from one brand to another (at least in their specs). It just insenses me when corporate big wigs put out misinformation in a feeble attempt to limit liability and warranty claims.

Yaw Sensors, Steering Wheel Angle (Sensor?), Brake Assist??? What are these exactly JetTech? Thanks for your (and everyones) insight so far.

The answer is "no, it will not matter" if you change all 4 tires. The answer is "yes, it will matter" if you go different front and rear.

I run shorter tires on the 17" off-road wheels in the rear at the track when dragracing and still have the stock 18" LE wheels and tires up front. If I leave the VDC on, it will activate the 'slip' light at about 20-25mph on the speedo. The VDC thinks the rears are spinning since they are rotating more revolutions than the fronts. This isn't a problem during a run because I turn off the VDC anyway (the traction control will absolutely kill a run if it activates).

The other thing to consider is that right now you can't correct the speedo for different tire sizes. The speedo calibrators you see all over the place will not work on our trucks. There is no "wire" to tap into since it's part of the CAN system.

So Head, if I am understanding you right, when you turn off the VDC you can light up your tires and make a 1/4 mile pass without the ABLS kicking in? So the VDC switch will also turn off the ABLS?

The answer is "no, it will not matter" if you change all 4 tires. The answer is "yes, it will matter" if you go different front and rear.

I run shorter tires on the 17" off-road wheels in the rear at the track when dragracing and still have the stock 18" LE wheels and tires up front. If I leave the VDC on, it will activate the 'slip' light at about 20-25mph on the speedo. The VDC thinks the rears are spinning since they are rotating more revolutions than the fronts. This isn't a problem during a run because I turn off the VDC anyway (the traction control will absolutely kill a run if it activates).

The other thing to consider is that right now you can't correct the speedo for different tire sizes. The speedo calibrators you see all over the place will not work on our trucks. There is no "wire" to tap into since it's part of the CAN system.

So Head, if I am understanding you right, when you turn off the VDC you can light up your tires and make a 1/4 mile pass without the ABLS kicking in? So the VDC switch will also turn off the ABLS?

When you shut off VDC it will not shut off ABLS. It shuts down all the inputs to VDC along with the throttle by wire function so you don't have to worry about the throttle cutting back on you. ABLS remains active...

I thought so! And it was a good point that not all manufacturers tires are the same diameter even though they are the same size! I have seen as much as 1/2 an inch difference from one brand to another (at least in their specs). It just insenses me when corporate big wigs put out misinformation in a feeble attempt to limit liability and warranty claims.

Yaw Sensors, Steering Wheel Angle (Sensor?), Brake Assist??? What are these exactly JetTech? Thanks for your (and everyones) insight so far.

Hi TH, these are all inputs that VDC is looking at to help compensate for an undesireable event. It looks at these inputs and then calculates how to straighten you back out by regulating the throttle plate and brakes at each wheel.

The answer is "no, it will not matter" if you change all 4 tires. The answer is "yes, it will matter" if you go different front and rear.

I run shorter tires on the 17" off-road wheels in the rear at the track when dragracing and still have the stock 18" LE wheels and tires up front. If I leave the VDC on, it will activate the 'slip' light at about 20-25mph on the speedo. The VDC thinks the rears are spinning since they are rotating more revolutions than the fronts. This isn't a problem during a run because I turn off the VDC anyway (the traction control will absolutely kill a run if it activates).

The other thing to consider is that right now you can't correct the speedo for different tire sizes. The speedo calibrators you see all over the place will not work on our trucks. There is no "wire" to tap into since it's part of the CAN system.

So Head, if I am understanding you right, when you turn off the VDC you can light up your tires and make a 1/4 mile pass without the ABLS kicking in? So the VDC switch will also turn off the ABLS?

When you shut off VDC it will not shut off ABLS. It shuts down all the inputs to VDC along with the throttle by wire function so you don't have to worry about the throttle cutting back on you. ABLS remains active...

So then how did M4ck smoke his tires in that video? No ABLS on the XE's???

Its just a gift from the Burnout Gods. LOL

So Head, if I am understanding you right, when you turn off the VDC you can light up your tires and make a 1/4 mile pass without the ABLS kicking in? So the VDC switch will also turn off the ABLS?

Yep. And yep.

Ok, I don't want to start a war but JetTech is saying that turning VDC OFF doesn't disable ABLS and The Head is saying it does? Can you both explain the source(s) of your conclusions? Thanks.

Its just a gift from the Burnout Gods. LOL

You lucky son of a motherless goat! Why do the Burnout Gods love you so much? No fair! :) Is there a chant or some sort of sacrifice I could offer up to them so that they will bless my Titan with loose tires? LOL

I could not do burnouts when I got it. After exhaust and intake I do now.
Whow knows I'm not gonna preach these things. It may just be broken in now.
I really dont know.
M4ck

On second thought I'm thinking it may have something to do with my striking good looks.
LOL
m4ck

On second thought I'm thinking it may have something to do with my striking good looks.
LOL
m4ck

If the ability to do burnouts is related to the looks of the driver I'm SOL. :) Hmmm . . . Maybe I'll have my wife try for a smokey burnout! "Oh Honey" . . . LOL

Ok, I don't want to start a war but JetTech is saying that turning VDC OFF doesn't disable ABLS and The Head is saying it does? Can you both explain the source(s) of your conclusions? Thanks.

No worries about any war TH, VDC will NOT turn off the ABLS. The_head can pm me for more information if he's confused or unsure.

So then how did M4ck smoke his tires in that video? No ABLS on the XE's???

That's correct, if he had a 4x4 then he would have that option because it's standard on 4x4's.

No worries about any war TH, VDC will NOT turn off the ABLS. The_head can pm me for more information if he's confused or unsure.

Then mine must be broken.

After making over 120 dragstrip runs and doing burnouts for every single one, when I hit the VDC off button and the light on the dash comes on to say that it is off, the ABLS does not function. If I forget to turn off the VDC (which has happened on a few occassions) then the ABLS will function and I cannot do a burnout.

No confusion and no mistaking here - either mine is wired differently or something else because I'm about 120 times for 120 times on the ABLS not functioning when the VDC is off on my truck.

I see there is some confusion head concerning exactly what VDC and ABLS do. Here's a little test for you......either in the rain, or on dry pavement, turn off your VDC, shove the throttle to the floor with no brakes. For a split second your right rear tire will start to spin, then the ABLS system grabs that brake and gets the other one spinning too. That's ABLS in action and there is no way, other then to disconnect the rear wheel sensors (of which is kind of cool) to turn it off.

Now I believe what your referring to head is the ability to overcome the throttle reduction that VDC is famous for. With the switch in, and a spinning wheel detected, the VDC will chop the throttle IF.........it has rotational input from all 4 wheels to compare. You can still powerbrake with the VDC switch in as long as your front tires don't move.

If your system is not working like I just described then you do have a problem with it....

Mine does not work that way.

I'm gonna just throw in what mine does too. :) I have a 4x4 without VDC. What I have found is that when you try to power brake the ABLS light kicks on and it feels like the truck bogs down for a couple second, then both wheels start to spin , the ABLS light goes off and my tires turn into smoke. I think mine is doing what it should be, it stops the one spinning wheel and gets them both going, then when they both are spinning the ABLS has done it's job. Head, it defenitly sounds like your ABLS is not working properly, if at all. But like Jet said, the ABLS is not a function that con be over ridin. You have to vision it as a limited slip diff and nothing more. You can't turn off a standard LSD can you? This is the same concept, just done with the brakes. It has no affect on power delivery of the truck. That being said, if when you power brake your truck it immediatly smokes both tires, then the ABLS won't even step in and do it's job as it isn't necessary, therefor seeming like it was turned off. :)

Mine does not work that way.

It would surprise me if your truck has a problem head, perhaps the system is working properly and you're just not aware of what it's really doing behind the scenes. If you would like, pm me your phone number and I'll call you later on this afternoon and try to explain it to you. Sometimes trying to explain things on the net is almost impossible.

Well I know what you all are saying, mine just does not do it that way. Really. I have the "one wheel peel" in the burnout box, the second wheel does not start spinning.

Save the phone calls (and long distance) for now. I've raced a lot of vehicles through the years and rebuilt several different posi units myself. I know what you're trying to tell me. But I'm also trying to tell you that mine does not work that way. And I think I have more test data on that than anyone.

If I leave the VDC on, the ABLS works exactly as you describe.

And I'm not saying this old dog can't learn new tricks but I do know what my truck is doing. And everything corresponds with people who have been outside the truck watching me in the burnout box. I hope I'm not coming across as a know-it-all (because I don't) since that is not my intention.

Another quick thing: the light that comes on in the dash, the "slip" light. It only comes on in my truck when the VDC is on. When I disengage it, the light never comes on no matter how much I burn the ONE spinning tire.

When I run shorter tires at the track, I could not make a pass on the track with the VDC on. The "slip" light comes on and the truck applies the brakes at about 20mph. I have even tried to drive "through" that but all you can feel are the brakes trying to stop or slow the wheels. I have to run with the VDC off or the ABLS will apply the brakes. I have about 50 runs to back that up.

Very strange. That just doesn't work like it should. :)

Well I know what you all are saying, mine just does not do it that way. Really. I have the "one wheel peel" in the burnout box, the second wheel does not start spinning.

Save the phone calls (and long distance) for now. I've raced a lot of vehicles through the years and rebuilt several different posi units myself. I know what you're trying to tell me. But I'm also trying to tell you that mine does not work that way. And I think I have more test data on that than anyone.

If I leave the VDC on, the ABLS works exactly as you describe.

And I'm not saying this old dog can't learn new tricks but I do know what my truck is doing. And everything corresponds with people who have been outside the truck watching me in the burnout box. I hope I'm not coming across as a know-it-all (because I don't) since that is not my intention.

I was only offering to call as a friendly gesture, not to try to teach you anything. Good luck head....

I give you a snipit from the maintenance manual. I read it several times and can see it working both ways. Somebody far smater than me will have to figure this out.

ABS Function EFS003JR

The Anti-Lock Brake System detects wheel revolution while braking and improves handling stability during
sudden braking by electrically preventing wheel lockup. Maneuverability is also improved for avoiding
obstacles.

If the electrical system malfunctions, the Fail-Safe function is activated, the ABS becomes inoperative and
the ABS warning lamp turns on.

The electrical system can be diagnosed using CONSULT-II.

During ABS operation, the brake pedal may vibrate lightly and a mechanical noise may be heard. This is
normal.

Just after starting the vehicle, the brake pedal may vibrate or a motor operating noise may be heard from
engine compartment. This is a normal status of operation check.

Stopping distance may be longer than that of vehicles without ABS when vehicle drives on rough, gravel,
or snow-covered (fresh, deep snow) roads.
EBD Function EFS003JS

Electronic Brake Distribution is a function that detects subtle slippages between the front and rear wheels
during braking, and it improves handling stability by electronically controlling the brake fluid pressure
which results in reduced rear wheel slippage.

If the electrical system malfunctions, the Fail-Safe function is activated, the EBD and ABS become inoperative,
and the ABS warning lamp and BRAKE warning lamp are turned on.

The electrical system can be diagnosed using CONSULT-II.

During EBD operation, the brake pedal may vibrate lightly and a mechanical noise may be heard. This is
normal.

Just after starting the vehicle, the brake pedal may vibrate or a motor operating noise may be heard from
engine compartment. This is a normal status of operation check.
TCS Function EFS003JT

Spinning of the drive wheels is detected by the ABS actuator and electric unit (contorl unit) control unit
using inputs from the wheel speed sensors. If wheel spin occurs, the drive wheel right and left brake fluid
pressure control and engine fuel cut are conducted while the throttle value is restricted to reduce the
engine torque and decrease the amount of wheel spin. In addition, the throttle opening is controlled to
achieve the optimum engine torque.

Depending on road condition, the vehicle may have a sluggish feel. This is normal, because optimum traction
has the highest priority during TCS operation.

TCS may be activated during sudden vehicle acceleration, wide open throttle acceleration, sudden transmission
shifts or when the vehicle is driven on a road with a varying surface friction coefficient.

The SLIP indicator lamp flashes to inform the driver of TCS operation.
VDC Function EFS003JU

In addition to the ABS/TCS function, the driver steering amount and brake operation amount are detected
from the steering angle sensor and pressure sensor, and the vehicle's driving status (amount of under
steering/over steering) is determined using inputs from the yaw rate sensor/side G sensor, wheel speed
sensors, etc. and this information is used to improve vehicle stability by controlling the braking and engine
torque application to the wheels.

The SLIP indicator lamp flashes to inform the driver of VDC operation.

During VDC operation, the vehicle body and brake pedal may vibrate lightly and a mechanical noise may
be heard. This is normal.

The ABS warning lamp, VDC OFF indicator lamp and SLIP indicator lamp may turn on when the vehicle is
subject to strong shaking or large vibration, such as when the vehicle is on a turn table or a ship while the
engine is running or on a steep slope. In this case, restart the engine on a normal road and if the ABS
warning lamp, VDC OFF indicator lamp and SLIP indicator lamp turn off, there is no problem.
Fail-Safe Function EFS003JV
CAUTION:
If the Fail-Safe function is activated, perform the Self Diagnosis for ABS/TCS/VDC system.
BRC-52[VDC/TCS/ABS]
SYSTEM DESCRIPTION
ABS/EBD SYSTEM
In case of an electrical malfunction with the ABS, the ABS warning lamp, VDC OFF indicator lamp and SLIP
indicator lamp will turn on. In case of an electrical malfunction with the EBD system, the BRAKE warning lamp,
ABS warning lamp, VDC OFF indicator lamp and SLIP indicator lamp will turn on.
The system will revert to one of the following conditions of the Fail-Safe function.
1. For ABS malfunction, only the EBD is operative and the condition of the vehicle is the same condition of
vehicles without ABS/TCS/VDC system.
2. For EBD malfunction, the EBD and ABS become inoperative, and the condition of the vehicle is the same
as the condition of vehicles without ABS/TCS/VDC or EBD system.
VDC/TCS SYSTEM
In case of TCS/VDC system malfunction, the VDC OFF indicator lamp and SLIP indicator lamp are turned on
and the condition of the vehicle is the same as the condition of vehicles without TCS/VDC system. In case of
an electrical malfunction with the TCS/VDC system, the ABS control continues to operate normally without
TCS/VDC control.

That's a good post with lots of info about ABS.... except we were talking about ABLS. :D ABS is for stopping and the ABLS if for going. :D

I was only offering to call as a friendly gesture, not to try to teach you anything. Good luck head....

And I appreciate that. You do a wonderful job explaining things to the members here. I finally got a few minutes to browse the service manual and look at some things but can't pin down the traction control stuff in relation to the VDC. I may try to look in the owner's manual (of all places) to see if there might be anything in there.

Don't take it as I don't want to talk to you about it, I just think combining info can be done here for the benefit of all to read.

pppsssstttt JT you can call me big boy.
LOL
m4ck

pppsssstttt JT you can call me big boy.
LOL
m4ck

Movin in on me are ya m4ck? LOL :wink:

And I appreciate that. You do a wonderful job explaining things to the members here. I finally got a few minutes to browse the service manual and look at some things but can't pin down the traction control stuff in relation to the VDC. I may try to look in the owner's manual (of all places) to see if there might be anything in there.

Don't take it as I don't want to talk to you about it, I just think combining info can be done here for the benefit of all to read.

That's fine head, I'm sure you'll find out the information you're looking for at your own pace. I'll be sure to use my saved toll call money on something a lot more important...

OK after looking through the owner's manual and the Nissan service manual, they do not sing the same song. Even in the owner's manual it doesn't make sense to me.
The owner's manual states (p. 5-29) "If the vehicle is operated with the vehicle dynamic control system off using the VDC OFF switch, all VDC and TCS functions will be turned off." This is what happens to me at the track. However, it also states: "The ABLS system and ABS will still operate with the VDC system OFF."

Now what strikes me as weird is that the definition of the TCS is defined in the Service Manual (p.BRC 51) as:
">Spinning of the drive wheels is detected by the ABS actuator and electric unit (contorl unit) control unit using inputs from the wheel speed sensors. If wheel spin occurs, the drive wheel right and left brake fluid pressure control and engine fuel cut are conducted while the throttle value is restricted to reduce the engine torque and decrease the amount of wheel spin. In addition, the throttle opening is controlled to achieve the optimum engine torque.

>Depending on road condition, the vehicle may have a sluggish feel. This is normal, because optimum trac-tion has the highest priority during TCS operation.

>TCS may be activated during sudden vehicle acceleration, wide open throttle acceleration, sudden trans-mission shifts or when the vehicle is driven on a road with a varying surface friction coefficient.

>The SLIP indicator lamp flashes to inform the driver of TCS operation." And this describes the function of the ABLS (when talking about braking functions).

I have looked for anything called 'ABLS' all over the Service Manual and can't find anything. This is where I think there is a disconnect between what is called the ABLS and the TCS. To me, the TCS is what is being referred to as the ABLS (with the throttle body functions as well). So I don't know why the owner's manaul can say that the TCS will be disabled and the ABLS will not when the switch is off. The owner's manual still says that the SLIP light will come on with activation of the ABLS with the VDC off and this hasn't happened (to me) yet when doing a burnout with the VDC off.

So, the owner's manual is the only thing indicating that the ABLS is still working, but yet it also states that the TCS is off - which is a contradiction. As far as I can tell, especially when using the Service Manual for info and doing character searches for ABLS (which it cannot find at all), the ABLS is just a way to describe the braking functions for the TCS and as the owner's manual states, is turned off with the VDC OFF button. I don't have an answer why in the very next sentence that the ABLS portion still works since for me, it does not. I think there was a thread on TT that the owner's manuals changed once in the 2004 year due to some people quoting page numbers (it was found on accident).

Are there any other Nissan sources of info out there?

That's a good post with lots of info about ABS.... except we were talking about ABLS. :D ABS is for stopping and the ABLS if for going. :D
After reading that section I came assumed that TCS was ABLS since I was unable to find any reference to ABLS in the maintenance manual. I could be wrong, thats why I put the information up for the smart people here to figure out. :D

That's a good post with lots of info about ABS.... except we were talking about ABLS. :D ABS is for stopping and the ABLS if for going. :D
After reading that section I came assumed that TCS was ABLS since I was unable to find any reference to ABLS in the maintenance manual. I could be wrong, thats why I put the information up for the smart people here to figure out. :D
And after reading again, you may very well be correct. :D I'm not convinced yet, but it's starting to look like it. :) No hard feelings?

More digging...

The nissan.usa website states the following if you select the titan under vehicles, driving dynamics, and then Active Brake Limited Slip: "Standard on 4x4; Part of Off-Road Package on 4x2" at the very end of the description. I have a 4x2. I do not have the off-road package. So according to the official Nissan website, I don't have ABLS at all.

Maybe the 4x2 non-off-road titans just have the TCS and do not have a full time active ABLS (?)

More digging...

The nissan.usa website states the following if you select the titan under vehicles, driving dynamics, and then Active Brake Limited Slip: "Standard on 4x4; Part of Off-Road Package on 4x2" at the very end of the description. I have a 4x2. I do not have the off-road package. So according to the official Nissan website, I don't have ABLS at all.

Maybe the 4x2 non-off-road titans just have the TCS and do not have a full time active ABLS (?)
Ahhhh, I think you may have just found teh winner! That makes perfect sense. :)

So, the owner's manual is the only thing indicating that the ABLS is still working, but yet it also states that the TCS is off - which is a contradiction. As far as I can tell, especially when using the Service Manual for info and doing character searches for ABLS (which it cannot find at all), the ABLS is just a way to describe the braking functions for the TCS and as the owner's manual states, is turned off with the VDC OFF button. I don't have an answer why in the very next sentence that the ABLS portion still works since for me, it does not. I think there was a thread on TT that the owner's manuals changed once in the 2004 year due to some people quoting page numbers (it was found on accident).

Are there any other Nissan sources of info out there?

Let me try to clear some of this up once again.....VDC, TCS and ABLS are all different, yet have linked functions through the CAN network.

TCS - Traction Control System is shut down when you disengage your VDC switch. The TCS controls your ETC - Electronic Throttle Control and one other thing I can't remember (I think injector pulse timing). So when you turn off your VDC, your throttle is no longer being controlled by the TCS. ABLS is STILL Active at this time. There is no way to shut it off and it has a different role then TCS as I've tried to describe here. They are not the same nor do they have the same function. They only cooperate with each other through the CAN network.

"The ABLS system and ABS will still operate with the VDC system OFF."

And this is why I was concerned in the beginning that your truck has a problem. You've stated numerous times that it doesn't operate like this, hopefully I've convinced you to think about taking it in and have a dealer look at it.

"The ABLS system and ABS will still operate with the VDC system OFF."

And this is why I was concerned in the beginning that your truck has a problem. You've stated numerous times that it doesn't operate like this, hopefully I've convinced you to think about taking it in and have a dealer look at it.
JT, I don't think his ABLS is not working, I think he doesn't have it.
Look at his previous post. Now it makes sense.
More digging...

The nissan.usa website states the following if you select the titan under vehicles, driving dynamics, and then Active Brake Limited Slip: "Standard on 4x4; Part of Off-Road Package on 4x2" at the very end of the description. I have a 4x2. I do not have the off-road package. So according to the official Nissan website, I don't have ABLS at all.

Maybe the 4x2 non-off-road titans just have the TCS and do not have a full time active ABLS (?)

TitanHauler, I think you are joining the two together. ABLS, Anti Locking Braking System, is not disabled. The titan does not have a limited slip rear end. So it senses slip at a location and send brake pressure there to transfer power to the other wheel. If you shut VDC off you still have anti lock brakes. But the system will not try to stop a spinning tire with the braking system and cutting the throttle. But I could be wrong!!! Wouldn't be the first time either....just don't tell my wife I said that! :lol:

That is true...not all the trucks have ABLS. Mine doesn't. I didn't want it because I am sure Dana will come out with true limited slip gears for this rear end. Hell they make it. Man....whatever happened to the old days where you had a simple engine with this little carb sitting on top of it. NOw you pop the hood and look....well...there's the engine! Now the damn thing tells you when your tires are low, where your at, ect. The shade tree mechanics are going out of business let me tell you.

Let me try to clear some of this up once again.....VDC, TCS and ABLS are all different, yet have linked functions through the CAN network.

Fair enough. Where is the technical description for the ABLS? I can't find it.


TCS - Traction Control System is shut down when you disengage your VDC switch. The TCS controls your ETC - Electronic Throttle Control and one other thing I can't remember (I think injector pulse timing). So when you turn off your VDC, your throttle is no longer being controlled by the TCS. ABLS is STILL Active at this time. There is no way to shut it off and it has a different role then TCS as I've tried to describe here. They are not the same nor do they have the same function. They only cooperate with each other through the CAN network.

The Nissan Service Manual specifically states that the TCS does control the wheel spin through the brakes, along with the other things you mention. My previous post is verbatim what it says in the manual.

OK. I'm not trying to be difficult, or argue for the sake of arguing, or be crass, rude, a jerk, nor am I trying to "start somethin'" or pound my chest..
But for me, this does not jive based on the info that I have found to this point. I hear you loud and clear Jet - I do. But I am wondering (maybe being an idiot in the process) if maybe, just maybe, the write-up on the Nissan site stating that 4x2s without off-road do not have the ABLS function. Looking at your avatar you have the 4x4 off-road which tells me that you do have ABLS and that even if you do turn off the VDC that the ABLS will still function on your truck, as you have stated several times and that goes with what the Nissan site states. And this line of thinking goes dead on correct for my truck not having an ABLS function with the VDC off.

I'll be at the dragstrip this Sunday and will make it a point to get a video recording of a long burnout to show that my other tire does not spin.

I also acknowledge your suggestion to get the dealer to look at my truck. However, for what I do with mine, I prefer to not have it "fixed". A working ABLS at the dragstrip (for me) would slow down the truck. The ABLS function works exactly like it should with the VDC normally on and like you, I really think it is very nice to have and keep things under better control for everyday use. I have driven in mud and from a standstill the ABLS function works just like it should. But at the track, I just don't want brakes of any kind coming on.

More digging...

The nissan.usa website states the following if you select the titan under vehicles, driving dynamics, and then Active Brake Limited Slip: "Standard on 4x4; Part of Off-Road Package on 4x2" at the very end of the description. I have a 4x2. I do not have the off-road package. So according to the official Nissan website, I don't have ABLS at all.

Maybe the 4x2 non-off-road titans just have the TCS and do not have a full time active ABLS (?)

The only wrench in that, at least for 2004, is if you have the Big Tow Package. I have a 4X2 Non Off-Road Package with Big Tow but I have VDC and ABLS as indicated on my window sticker. So maybe if you have a 4X2 Non Off-Road without Big Tow then you would not have ABLS?

I have the big tow. The Nissan site doesn't say that the ABLS is part of the big tow that I could find.

My previous truck was a 4x2 with big tow, no off road and it had VDC. The ABLS on that one worked exactly like the one I have now. I'm at a loss head, I can't for the life of me figure this one out.

Let's just try to settle something once and for all though, please don't worry about any chest banging or controversy with this topic. I find it incredibly interesting as others may too. Ok, just wanted to make sure we understand each other because all is cool here and I like your tone of writing. It appears you want to get to the bottom of this like I do, so lets keep that as our goal.. :)

On to another story......When I had my 4x2, I unhooked the rear wheel sensors just for the heck of it one day. It did incredible smoky one wheel burn outs. So I hooked everything back up and it would only put down about 4ft. of rubber before the other tire would join in, then after about 3 ft' of both of them spinning it would hook up and take off.

This is a "head" scratcher... :? :lol:

LOL Why ask why? Just drive the crap outa it till it falls apart its under warranty right? lol
but yeh if I was as smart as you guys I would probably try to figure it out too.
M4ck

That's a good post with lots of info about ABS.... except we were talking about ABLS. :D ABS is for stopping and the ABLS if for going. :D
After reading that section I came assumed that TCS was ABLS since I was unable to find any reference to ABLS in the maintenance manual. I could be wrong, thats why I put the information up for the smart people here to figure out. :D
And after reading again, you may very well be correct. :D I'm not convinced yet, but it's starting to look like it. :) No hard feelings?

None at all. hopefully with everyone looking at this we can figure it out.

I have the big tow. The Nissan site doesn't say that the ABLS is part of the big tow that I could find.

Take a look at your window sticker if you still have it. Here is mine.

I hope this will answer the question. This is strait from the owners manual. It's kinda long so I bolded the answer. I hope.

When accelerating or driving on slippery surfaces,
the tires may spin or slide. With the Vehicle
Dynamic Control (VDC) system, sensors detect
these movements and control the braking and
engine output to help improve vehicle stability.
When the vehicle dynamic control (VDC)
system is operating, the slip indicator in the
instrument panel blinks.
When only the traction control system (TCS)
portion of the vehicle dynamic control system
is operating, the slip indicator will also
blink.
If the slip indicator blinks, the road conditions
are slippery. Be sure to adjust your
speed and driving to these conditions. See
“Slip indicator light”, and “Vehicle dynamic
control off indicator light” in the “Instruments
and controls” section.
Indicator light
If malfunction occurs in the system,
the and indicator lights come
on in the instrument panel.
As long as these warning lights are on, the
traction control function is canceled.
The VDC system uses an Active Brake Limited
Slip (ABLS) system to improve vehicle traction.
The ABLS system works when one of the driving
wheels is spinning on a slippery surface. The
ABLS system brakes the spinning wheel which
distributes the driving power to the other drive
wheel. If the vehicle is operated with the vehicle
dynamic control system off using the VDC OFF
switch, all VDC and ABLS functions will be
turned off. The ABS will still operate with the VDC
system off. If the ABLS system is activated, the
slip indicator light will blink and you may hear a
clunk noise and/or feel a pulsation in the brake
pedal. This is normal.
While the VDC system is operating, you may feel
a pulsation in the brake pedal and hear a noise or
vibration from under the hood. This is normal and
indicates that the VDC system is working properly.
The computer has a built in diagnostic feature
that tests the system each time you start the
engine and move the vehicle forward or in reverse
at a slow speed. When the self-test occurs, you
may hear a clunk noise and/or feel a pulsation in
the brake pedal. This is normal and is not an
indication of a malfunction.

If the vehicle is operated with the vehicle dynamic control system off using the VDC OFF switch, all VDC and ABLS functions will be turned off. The ABS will still operate with the VDC system off.

So is the owner's manual right or wrong???

Let's just try to settle something once and for all though, please don't worry about any chest banging or controversy with this topic. I find it incredibly interesting as others may too. Ok, just wanted to make sure we understand each other because all is cool here and I like your tone of writing. It appears you want to get to the bottom of this like I do, so lets keep that as our goal.. :)


Absolutely.

Dunno what to guess any more. I may try to contact some Nissan engineers or something.

More info.

OK last trip out to the dragstrip I noticed something. On a couple of launches, I would get spin. Even with the VDC off, the "slip" light would come on but I didn't feel the big time power shutdown like when the VDC is active. Now then, when doing stationary burnouts with the VDC off, no "slip" light as usual. So I'm thinking it may do more when it senses the front wheels turning vice when they are not. I dunno. But it's another piece of data.
I still get the one wheel peel unless I am purging my nitrous in the burnout area - then both spin.

Hi,
On my early 04 model, turning off the VDC has always had the effect of nullifying the abs anti-spin feature.
I take advantage of it often. :D
Titanosaurus Rex

More info.

OK last trip out to the dragstrip I noticed something. On a couple of launches, I would get spin. Even with the VDC off, the "slip" light would come on but I didn't feel the big time power shutdown like when the VDC is active. Now then, when doing stationary burnouts with the VDC off, no "slip" light as usual. So I'm thinking it may do more when it senses the front wheels turning vice when they are not. I dunno. But it's another piece of data.
I still get the one wheel peel unless I am purging my nitrous in the burnout area - then both spin.

Interesting Head! You may just be right! I assume you purge your Nitrous by activating it real quick while burning out? Have you thought about adding a purge kit?

yeah I tap it a couple of times real quick to try and make sure some of the boiled nitrous in the line is purged out. I'd get a purge kit but then everyone would see it. I could hide it but if I had one, I'd want to see that it was blowing liquid. So since I'd have to hide it, I'll just give it the quick taps I do now. In reality I haven't noticed a real difference in how it reacts to me purging it this way or not. Sometimes I won't purge it at all.